RESPONSE to Seminar by Kaunteya Das titled; “How to mess up your life with Varnasrama” PART 1

Srila Prabhupada often said the religious process we are following is not Hinduism, but Varnasrama Dharma or Sanatana Dharma and he repeatedly glorified and stressed the necessity of establishing and following Varnasrama duties in his purports and lectures. Towards the end of his manifest presence, in his last instructions to his disciples and followers, he ordered us to ‘immediately’ establish Varnasrama colleges wherever our temples are, as a prerequisite to establishing Varnasrama. In other words, all temples, leaders and members of ISKCON should be working towards this. What to speak of Srila Prabhupada, Bhaktivinoda Thakura (the grandfather of ISKCON who pioneered the worldwide spread of the sankirtan movement) also wanted it and ordered his disciple and son Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura to establish Varnasrama.

So it was quite astounding and horrifying to see that Seminar no. 15 in this year’s Iskcon Leaders Sangha (ILS) 2020 held from 14^th – 20^th February at Mayapur was titled: “How to Mess up your life with Varnasrama” by Kaunteya Das. The content of the seminar was concentrated on giving different scenarios when, and how Varnasrama can create problems if implemented and so it should not be implemented at all or not fully implemented in ISKCON (the conclusion was unclear). This of course is in contradiction to Srila Prabhupada’s order to ‘immediately’ implement varnasrama. In this article we examine how the points used in the seminar to show how varnasrama is not practical or fully implementable, by calling into question some of its systems, precepts, practices and citing the current state of social affairs in the world; are erroneous in trying to show how varnasrama can mess up our lives. The article was written by listening to the recording of the seminar and so the exact time in the recording, of the points made is indicated. The recording of the seminar can be found online. We also found while writing this response that this seminar was delivered at the GBC College in Tirupati also, with the title tactfully changed to; “How to Mess up your life with (misapplied) Varnasrama”. We appeal to anyone hearing this seminar to form their opinion about Varnasrama – by studying Srila Prabhupada’s books and lectures, and not from points in this seminar.

The title of the Seminar

Before we consider the content of the seminar, let us consider the title. The title is offensive because, as mentioned above, the establishing of Varnasrama was the desire of Srila Prabhupada, Sri Guru parampara and Sri Krsna, and so is dear to the hearts of all those who call themselves Vaisnavas or Prabhupadanugas. If something is dear to my Gurus or my worshipable lord, then I would not like to see it in a title indicating how that thing can mess up our life. I will give an example. If I give a seminar titled; “How to mess up your life with Srimad Bhagavatam”, then whatever else I said in the seminar, even if it is not against Srimad Bhagavatam, it is still offensive to Vaisnavas because Srimad Bhagavatam is dear to the Vaisnavas (SB 12.13.18). So it is for Varnasrama also (visnur aradhyate pantha nanyat tat-tosa-karanam), which is pleasing to Visnu and therefore dear to Vaisnavas.

Another point is that Varnasrama is an institution created by Krsna (BG 4.13, BG 18.41-44), as a material solution for organizing society and providing the most ideal social, economic, cultural and religious system which are factors needed in any civilized society. He says therein that if everyone follows their varnasrama duty and worships Him then they will get perfection (BG 18.45-6). Srila Prabhupada says in the purport:

Everyone should think that he is engaged in a particular type of occupation by Hrsikesa, the master of the senses. And by the result of the work in which one is engaged, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Sri Krsna, should be worshiped. If one thinks always in this way, in full Krsna consciousness, then, by the grace of the Lord, he becomes fully aware of everything. That is the perfection of life.

[Bg 18.46, purport]

Therefore we see that varnasram is a supreme all-encompassing solution to the material needs of the conditioned soul which enable him to ultimately also attain supreme perfection, when he worships the supreme lord while preforming his God-given duty in society. Even if we begin to follow only a fraction of it, it will bring auspiciousness and relief from material miseries. So how can this mess up our lives in any way at all? Rather, the opposite. Today in India we see remnants of varnasrama and we see that India is more peaceful, with more stable families, more dutiful wives and husbands, more disciplined children, better businessmen, better scholars and better warriors than the west due to the remnants of their varnasrama past. It should be noted that the author is not from a vedic/hindu background and not born in India, so this is not self-aggrandizement.

I have to say that more than the unpleasantness I felt at seeing the title of this seminar was the fact that it was held openly in the most auspicious place for Gaudiya Vaisnavas, at the most auspicious time of the year for Gaudiya vaisnavas in a gathering of the future and current leaders of our Vaisnava movement, and no one protested about it.

The content of the Seminar

Varnasrama is inseparable from Vaishnava society at least here in the material world and has been mentioned and glorified in all our Vaisnava literatures and by all our Vaisnava gurus. It was prominent in all other Vaisnava sampradayas, why should we think it should not apply to us? Sannyasis, brahmacaris, grhasthas, stri-dharma etc., were always part of Vaisnava societies as we read in our scriptures. Thus our meditation should be on how to serve Sri Guru and Sri Krsna and please them by propagating and glorifying Varnasrama, and not on how it should not be implemented because of A,B and C. Srila Prabhupada gave numerous reasons why it should be implemented and how to overcome the obstacles to its implementation not how we can mess up our life with Varnasrama.

We now begin to see the points made in the seminar. The introduction to the seminar explained the importance of varnasrama. Then points were made in the seminar on how points in support of establishing varnasrama and many of its aspects are not necessarily beneficial, possible or practical in this age. In order to support these points selective quotes of Srila Prabhupada were given. We feel that by giving only selective quotes, not a full picture of Srila Prabhupada’s opinion was revealed in some of these points. Below the comments in the seminar appear in bold and the figure preceding it is the time in the seminar where the comment can be found.

00:05:00 – Varnasrama norms, rules, traditions are very good, beneficial for our development, and our purification but the elements should be healthy and functioning, otherwise it could be very much counterproductive. Just as accepting a spiritual master is enjoined in sastra and highly beneficial, but a false guru will end our spiritual life with false teachings. 

Here an analogy was given about how – just as accepting a spiritual master is important, the wrong type of spiritual master can cause havoc in one’s life; similarly, in varnasrama all the roles should be functioning correctly otherwise it will be harmful. What is implied is that just as one rejects a false guru, so in any relation in varnasrama where the other party is not doing their duty we need not do our duty in that relationship in varnasrama and can reject that relation.

So according to him in this way one should reject a wrong wife, wrong husband and wrong authority, and a new relation established where both sides are functioning.

The idea of giving up a guru who has deviated is taken from a verse in Mahabharata, in Udyoga-parva 179.25;

guror apy avaliptasya
karyakaryam ajanatah
utpatha-prathipannasya
parityago vidhiyate

"A guru who does not know what is to be done and what is not to be done, who has left the path of devotional service, should be abandoned."

The main point of the idea in this verse is that the disciple should remain a proper follower of sastra and dharma and so if the guru deviates from that path then he cannot guide the disciple properly and the disciple should give him up, and accept another guru who can guide him along the dharmic path according to sastra. But he has used this verse to say that if the other party in a varnasrama setup is not doing their role then we should reject that whole relationship. In other words he is saying they should go against sastra. The idea of extrapolating this verse of giving up a non-bonafide guru to giving up any other relation which is not functioning is not correct use of this concept.

According to this thesis of his, a woman in a marriage who sees that her husband is not doing his duty, should abandon her duty and can also abandon the marriage. This is adharmic, as divorce is not allowed in Vedic culture and is sinful. We see in a similar situation Srila Prabhupada’s sister remained in her marriage and continued doing her duty exemplarily as did Mandodari, Ravana’s wife. Thus, those who propagate this thesis that there is no harm not following one's duty if one's partner doesn't follow his/hers duty perfectly, are people deviated from sastras (such as the giver of this seminar) and should not be followed but given up according to the guror-apy-avaliptasya verse.

The point is that varnasrama should be established, and here he is saying that if it is partially established with all varna’s not doing their roles properly then it is dangerous and counterproductive. Firstly, although Srila Prabhupada spoke on Varnasrama many times and the urgency of doing so, he never made this point that it should all be implemented all at once in a one go or not all, otherwise it will be dangerous.

Is Kaunteya Prabhu proposing here that we should wait till we are ready to fully implement varnasrama, and then at some particular date implement it all at once with everyone doing their respective duties suddenly? That is not possible and so as we can see, varnasrama was established a little at a time. Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura took sannyasa, established the brahmacari asramas, grhastha asramas, upheld stri-dharma practices, introduced brahmin diksha and preached to each of these groups to do their duty. In no way was it the full implementation of varnasrama. Srila Prabhupada followed suit by implementing all of this in ISKCON in the same way and told us to fully implement varnasrama. So was Srila Prabhupada and his guru Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura wrong or doing some dangerous practice by partially implementing varnasrama? No, because that is how it will have to be done. There will be some mistakes, some exploitation etc until the system is perfected. Anyway in this material world which is inherently imperfect there will be those imperfections even if we don’t try to implement varnasrama. In this way we can see that this point is not correct.

00:06:30 – According to sociological concepts, roles of individuals are interdependent and interrelated and as one role changes, other roles also have to do so. If you were to remember one word from this seminar, it is ‘interdependence’. Duties and roles don’t stand by themselves, they change according to time place and circumstance.

He mentioned above that roles are interdependent, which is true. And that as one role changes others must do so – this is not a Vedic concept. Someone not doing their duty is acting sinfully, as Krsna told Arjuna, Arjuna being convinced of this asked Krsna what it is that makes someone not want to do their duty (BG 3.36) and Krsna said it was because of kama. If someone succumbs to kama and doesn’t do their duty, should everyone change? Not so says Manu Samhita in Chapter 8, verse 15 which states that: one who protects or upholds dharma is protected by it (dharma raksito raksitah). This means there will be times when people will defy or not act according to varnasrama or sastra and our duty is to resist that change and remain dharmic, and fixed in our role. Being conditioned souls with material contamination, we will always have many reasons to not do our duty, one such excuse is that, others are not doing their duty, so why should I? According to BG 3.9 we are supposed to do our work for the satisfaction of Visnu so there is no consideration on whether others are doing their duty or not. It seems like here the confusion came due to juxtaposing modern materialistic study of sociology with eternal Vedic concepts. As followers of Vedic religion, thought and culture, our basis of thought should be based on Vedic concepts which are perfect as they have a divine origin, rather than mundane sociology by imperfect conditioned souls.

00:09:00 – Things don’t stand by themselves. If a role mutates, other roles change…If conditions change prescriptions of sastra change, then instructions of sastras change and roles change. It may be no more applicable or need to be somewhat modified to apply.

It is dangerous for conditioned souls to change or modify roles, rules and regulations given in sastra (BG 16.23). Acaryas appear and show us how to live according to sastra in our age. They are empowered by Krsna and yet they do not transgress sastra although they may give some temporary change to. We cannot whimsically change sastric rules and directions. We simply have to follow their guidelines. Some people claim that Srila Prabhupada changed some points in sastra for us in this age, but Srila Prabhupada himself says the spiritual master must follow sastra or he is not a spiritual master.

The actual center is the sastra, the revealed scripture. If a spiritual master does not speak according to the revealed scripture, he is not to be accepted. Similarly, if a saintly person does not speak according to the sastra, he is not a saintly person. The sastra is the center for all. Unfortunately, at the present moment, people do not refer to the sastras;

Caitanya Caritamrta Madhya 20.352

If there was some adjustment to societal roles that Srila Prabhupada made it must be considered temporary, and the sastric roles or principles are to be reintroduced otherwise why would he mention the point above? At any rate, we are not qualified to change any rules of sastra. Srila Prabhupada, the acarya, has given his opinion on varnasrama and that we should establish it. He has clearly delineated roles of brahmanas, ksatriyas, women, sannyasis, brahmacaris, farming in his books and those instructions are non-different from sastra. Edicts of sastra are eternal;

There is no compromise. This is real religion. The Krsna says, na ca tasmad manusyesu kascid me priya-krttamah. So this is the person who has received the authority to draw mercy water from the ocean of mercy of Krsna. Saksad-dharitvena samasta-sastraih. And what Krsna said five thousand years ago, the same thing Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, same thing. There was no change, as there was no change between the statement of Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura and Narottama dasa Thakura. Sadhu sastra. As sastra, there is no change. Not that "Modernize. The sastra should be changed." No. That is nonsense. That is not sastra. Sastra cannot be changed. "Circumstantially, it will be changed, seasonal changes." No. That is not sastra. Sastra means it is perpetual.

The sastra cannot be changed. God’s words cannot be changed. Then what will be the difference between God and ourself? He is always perfect. He is always perfect. What He said forty millions of years ago, what He said five thousand years ago, that is also correct up to date. That is sastra. Not that "So many years have passed and it has become old. Now let us reform it and put it into a new way. No. You can put the same thing in a new way, but you cannot change the principle. Sadhu sastra guru-vakya, tinete kariya aikya. Sastra is never changed. And the sadhu... Sadhu means who follows the sastras. He is sadhu. He also does not change. Sadhu, sastra. And guru? Guru means who follows the sastra and sadhu. So there are three, the same. A guru will not change, that "it was spoken five thousand years ago. That is not applicable now. Now I am giving you something new, jugglery." He is useless. Sadhu sastra guru-vakya tinete kariya aikya. Yah sastra-vidhim utsrjya vartate kama karatah, na siddhim avapnoti [Bg 16.23].”

Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.6.8 Vrndavana, November 30, 1976

In conclusion, the roles that are given in Srila Prabhupada’s books and in sastra should be followed as our guru-parampara, and Krsna desired and we should not change them giving an excuse of change in circumstances, society etc.